LZ W Horsa (Knotts Photo)

Discussion in 'Troop Carrier & Glider' started by Pat Curran, Jun 23, 2013.

  1. Pat Curran

    Pat Curran Administrator
    Staff Member

    Oct 20, 2012
    2,634
    17
    Co. Kilkenny, Ireland
    Hi All,

    You may recall a while back that we discovered photo albums by Kenny L. Knotts of the 307th Airborne Medical Company, 82nd Airborne Division on the US Army Heritage and Education Center site. That part of the collection pertaining to the Normandy Campaign is spread in the main, over two albums:
    Kenny went to Normandy as part of Mission 'Elmira' on the evening of the 6th June. The Horsa glider in which he flew was part of the second serial of 36 Horsas and 14 Wacos of the 438th TCG out of Greenham Common.

    Kenny took a number of photographs showing his Horsa both before departure and following the glider's landing in Normandy in the immediate LZ W area. These are filed in the Brown Album as follows:
    • Page 6 of 41 (Top Right & Bottom Right)
    • Page 7 of 41 (Bottom Right)
    • Page 13 of 41 (Bottom Left and Bottom Right)
    • Page 14 of 41 (Top Left)
    The Horsa is marked #42 (with underscore) - note especially the wide 'hook' of the digit '2' on the cockpit's port side in the photograph from page 13. Here is a zoomed version:
    [​IMG]
    While recently viewing Tyler Alberts '82nd Airborne Division - Invasion of Normandy Series' DVD, I believe I may have come across footage showing Kenny's Horsa at Greenham Common. Though the location is not specified in the footage, the screenshot below taken at time mark 32:00 shows, almost certainly in my view, Kenny's #42 Horsa being towed past three officers at Greenham Common:
    [​IMG]
    Note again the wide 'hook' of the digit '2' on the port side and the slightly lower '42' on the nose. In addition, the footage shows several shots of C-47s with the 'M2' marking of the 88th TCS, 438th TCG. These sequences, though separated by cuts from the screenshot above, can only have been shot at Greenham Common.

    In addition, the same sequence of footage shows a Waco marked #1 also under tow with a confirmed serial number of 43-40145:
    [​IMG]
    [​IMG]
    As can be seen from the listing below, this Waco was one of the 14 from the second serial of Mission Elmira, departing Greenham Common. It appears to have been carrying elements of the 82nd Airborne Signal Company:
    [​IMG]

    Not conclusive but well over my personal 80% certainty threshold.

    On the down side, my earlier theory on the use of the underscore to identify and separate gliders based on the same field for different missions (Ramsbury and Aldermaston) now seems shot to pieces :D

    You can read more on the 307th Medical Company on Ben Major's excellent 'WW2 US Medical Research Centre' site here.

    Regards,

    Pat
     
  2. Jonesy

    Jonesy Active Member
    Researcher

    Nov 23, 2014
    224
    2
    Wiltshire, UK
    Underscore = 438th TCG
    Overscore = 435th TCG
    Dot under number = 436th TCG

    All three aforementioned Troop Carrier Groups flew Mission Elmira the other being the 437th but I cannot find photographic proof of how their chalk numbers looked.

    I wonder if the 53rd TCW stipulated that the chalk numbers differentiated between its Groups?
     
  3. Pat Curran

    Pat Curran Administrator
    Staff Member

    Oct 20, 2012
    2,634
    17
    Co. Kilkenny, Ireland
    Neil,

    Any idea as to the use of letters such as 'H', 'R' and IIRC, 'P'?

    Thanks,

    Pat
     
  4. Jonesy

    Jonesy Active Member
    Researcher

    Nov 23, 2014
    224
    2
    Wiltshire, UK
    R and E I believe were 437th Mission Galveston Chalk markings
     

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